Accounts!!

HackJowarth
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 11:18 pm
Re: Accounts!!

Post by HackJowarth » Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:55 pm

James Frazer wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:49 pm
HackJowarth wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:36 pm
HackJowarth wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 9:21 am
The ATFC Limited Accounts have been circulated to Shareholders etc. To say they don’t make good reading would be a huge understatement!! Of course, they need “approving” at The AGM which, is forthcoming. Said Accounts will be in the public eye via Companies House in due course. Good luck to anyone trying to explain that lot away!!
The Accounts circulated are unaudited!
"Your company may qualify for an audit exemption if it has at least 2 of the following:
  • an annual turnover of no more than £10.2 million
    assets worth no more than £5.1 million
    50 or fewer employees on average
"
You are correct. However, should the Shareholders insist on an audit, this should be complied with.

James Frazer
Posts: 9
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2010 2:25 pm
Location: Alexandra Park
Re: Accounts!!

Post by James Frazer » Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:02 pm

HackJowarth wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:55 pm
James Frazer wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:49 pm
HackJowarth wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:36 pm


The Accounts circulated are unaudited!
"Your company may qualify for an audit exemption if it has at least 2 of the following:
  • an annual turnover of no more than £10.2 million
    assets worth no more than £5.1 million
    50 or fewer employees on average
"
You are correct. However, should the Shareholders insist on an audit, this should be complied with.
True, but given the high cost of audit, how many shareholders are going to demand this ?
"Even if your company is usually exempt from an audit, you must get your accounts audited if shareholders who own at least 10% of shares (by number or value) ask you to. This can be an individual shareholder or a group of shareholders.
They must make the request in writing and send it to the company’s registered office address.
The request must arrive at least one month before the end of the financial year that the audit is being asked for."

HackJowarth
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 11:18 pm
Re: Accounts!!

Post by HackJowarth » Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:33 pm

James Frazer wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:02 pm
HackJowarth wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:55 pm
James Frazer wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:49 pm


"Your company may qualify for an audit exemption if it has at least 2 of the following:
  • an annual turnover of no more than £10.2 million
    assets worth no more than £5.1 million
    50 or fewer employees on average
"
You are correct. However, should the Shareholders insist on an audit, this should be complied with.
True, but given the high cost of audit, how many shareholders are going to demand this ?
"Even if your company is usually exempt from an audit, you must get your accounts audited if shareholders who own at least 10% of shares (by number or value) ask you to. This can be an individual shareholder or a group of shareholders.
They must make the request in writing and send it to the company’s registered office address.
The request must arrive at least one month before the end of the financial year that the audit is being asked for."
Again, salient points. The cost of audit would be worth every red cent should it uncover some creativity in my opinion.

ACA
Posts: 23
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 12:54 am
Re: Accounts!!

Post by ACA » Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:38 pm

I think you need to be a bit careful when making such insinuations on a public forum...

HackJowarth
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 11:18 pm
Re: Accounts!!

Post by HackJowarth » Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:42 pm

ACA wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:38 pm
I think you need to be a bit careful when making such insinuations on a public forum...
No insinuations, just an opinion, as stated

brian bloomfield
Posts: 32
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:00 am
Location: Barcelona
Re: Accounts!!

Post by brian bloomfield » Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:08 pm

Unless anyone has anything specific re financial mismanagement, player contract, VAT/ PAYE or grant funding fraud then an audit is a waste of time and money. The accounts have been prepared by the clubs accountants who are a well trusted organisation and very thorough. That's not to say a 609k loss isn't absolutely gross incompetence but I'm sure some kind of answers will be provided at the AGM.
It will be interesting to see if we are breaking even this season, which is a possibility with the budget apparently greatly reduced.

WTF
Posts: 59
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 9:17 am
Re: Accounts!!

Post by WTF » Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:14 pm

brian bloomfield wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:08 pm
Unless anyone has anything specific re financial mismanagement, player contract, VAT/ PAYE or grant funding fraud then an audit is a waste of time and money. The accounts have been prepared by the clubs accountants who are a well trusted organisation and very thorough. That's not to say a 609k loss isn't absolutely gross incompetence but I'm sure some kind of answers will be provided at the AGM.
It will be interesting to see if we are breaking even this season, which is a possibility with the budget apparently greatly reduced.
I hear what you say Brian, but can that be right with an apparent 400k less budget?

brian bloomfield
Posts: 32
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:00 am
Location: Barcelona
Re: Accounts!!

Post by brian bloomfield » Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:28 pm

WTF wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:14 pm
brian bloomfield wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:08 pm
Unless anyone has anything specific re financial mismanagement, player contract, VAT/ PAYE or grant funding fraud then an audit is a waste of time and money. The accounts have been prepared by the clubs accountants who are a well trusted organisation and very thorough. That's not to say a 609k loss isn't absolutely gross incompetence but I'm sure some kind of answers will be provided at the AGM.
It will be interesting to see if we are breaking even this season, which is a possibility with the budget apparently greatly reduced.
I hear what you say Brian, but can that be right with an apparent 400k less budget?
I think the total reduction acoss the board is 400k

We lost 609k on a standing start budget last season so we could break even based on the following

250k saved in non termination payments this season and salary reductions to key management positions.
200k less playing budget
In addition I calculated that we would of been 150k down on gate money, so there's your 600k,easily done if you don't know what your'e doing.

So a break even figure is possible but highly unlikely, I would expect circa 100k loss this season as it's impossible to keep all budget lines in place due to so many variables.

Statto
Posts: 25
Joined: Sun Feb 04, 2007 5:05 pm
Location: Aldershot
Re: Accounts!!

Post by Statto » Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:23 pm

HackJowarth wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 9:21 am
The ATFC Limited Accounts have been circulated to Shareholders etc. To say they don’t make good reading would be a huge understatement!! Of course, they need “approving” at The AGM which, is forthcoming. Said Accounts will be in the public eye via Companies House in due course. Good luck to anyone trying to explain that lot away!!
I didn't receive any accounts. All I got was the letter advising me of the AGM, an agenda for said AGM and a Form of Proxy.

In fact, I don't ever recall getting accounts up front. I always thought it odd that the first time that I (and, no doubt, many others) got to see the accounts was when they were handed out on the night, which doesn't really give you adequate time to review them and ask pertinent, informed questions.

HackJowarth
Posts: 10
Joined: Sun Apr 19, 2015 11:18 pm
Re: Accounts!!

Post by HackJowarth » Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:48 pm

Statto wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:23 pm
HackJowarth wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 9:21 am
The ATFC Limited Accounts have been circulated to Shareholders etc. To say they don’t make good reading would be a huge understatement!! Of course, they need “approving” at The AGM which, is forthcoming. Said Accounts will be in the public eye via Companies House in due course. Good luck to anyone trying to explain that lot away!!
I didn't receive any accounts. All I got was the letter advising me of the AGM, an agenda for said AGM and a Form of Proxy.


In fact, I don't ever recall getting accounts up front. I always thought it odd that the first time that I (and, no doubt, many others) got to see the accounts was when they were handed out on the night, which doesn't really give you adequate time to review them and ask pertinent, informed questions.
If you are a Shareholder, you need to request them. Legally, the Limited Company must send them to you.

WTF
Posts: 59
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 9:17 am
Re: Accounts!!

Post by WTF » Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:46 am

brian bloomfield wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:28 pm
WTF wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:14 pm
brian bloomfield wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:08 pm
Unless anyone has anything specific re financial mismanagement, player contract, VAT/ PAYE or grant funding fraud then an audit is a waste of time and money. The accounts have been prepared by the clubs accountants who are a well trusted organisation and very thorough. That's not to say a 609k loss isn't absolutely gross incompetence but I'm sure some kind of answers will be provided at the AGM.
It will be interesting to see if we are breaking even this season, which is a possibility with the budget apparently greatly reduced.
I hear what you say Brian, but can that be right with an apparent 400k less budget?
I think the total reduction acoss the board is 400k

We lost 609k on a standing start budget last season so we could break even based on the following

250k saved in non termination payments this season and salary reductions to key management positions.
200k less playing budget
In addition I calculated that we would of been 150k down on gate money, so there's your 600k,easily done if you don't know what your'e doing.

So a break even figure is possible but highly unlikely, I would expect circa 100k loss this season as it's impossible to keep all budget lines in place due to so many variables.
Thanks Brian I get that. The club has a hard core of fans and if I might say older ones lol. What concerns me is attracting the younger fan who these days look for positives in everything, which you can't argue with rather than I'm supporting the Shots because my grandad, dad etc did as in family tradition. Do you believe our last couple of seasons on the pitch will affect our future support or when we start to see a turn around that the support will come back?

brian bloomfield
Posts: 32
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 10:00 am
Location: Barcelona
Re: Accounts!!

Post by brian bloomfield » Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:30 am

WTF wrote:
Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:46 am
brian bloomfield wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:28 pm
WTF wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:14 pm


I hear what you say Brian, but can that be right with an apparent 400k less budget?
I think the total reduction acoss the board is 400k

We lost 609k on a standing start budget last season so we could break even based on the following

250k saved in non termination payments this season and salary reductions to key management positions.
200k less playing budget
In addition I calculated that we would of been 150k down on gate money, so there's your 600k,easily done if you don't know what your'e doing.

So a break even figure is possible but highly unlikely, I would expect circa 100k loss this season as it's impossible to keep all budget lines in place due to so many variables.
Thanks Brian I get that. The club has a hard core of fans and if I might say older ones lol. What concerns me is attracting the younger fan who these days look for positives in everything, which you can't argue with rather than I'm supporting the Shots because my grandad, dad etc did as in family tradition. Do you believe our last couple of seasons on the pitch will affect our future support or when we start to see a turn around that the support will come back?
I am forever amazed at how passionate, vocal and how many young fans we have. The saying "We don't have Young Fans" is a myth in my opinion.

WTF
Posts: 59
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 9:17 am
Re: Accounts!!

Post by WTF » Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:34 am

brian bloomfield wrote:
Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:30 am
WTF wrote:
Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:46 am
brian bloomfield wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:28 pm


I think the total reduction acoss the board is 400k

We lost 609k on a standing start budget last season so we could break even based on the following

250k saved in non termination payments this season and salary reductions to key management positions.
200k less playing budget
In addition I calculated that we would of been 150k down on gate money, so there's your 600k,easily done if you don't know what your'e doing.

So a break even figure is possible but highly unlikely, I would expect circa 100k loss this season as it's impossible to keep all budget lines in place due to so many variables.
Thanks Brian I get that. The club has a hard core of fans and if I might say older ones lol. What concerns me is attracting the younger fan who these days look for positives in everything, which you can't argue with rather than I'm supporting the Shots because my grandad, dad etc did as in family tradition. Do you believe our last couple of seasons on the pitch will affect our future support or when we start to see a turn around that the support will come back?
I am forever amazed at how passionate, vocal and how many young fans we have. The saying "We don't have Young Fans" is a myth in my opinion.
Ah, I wasn't actually saying we don't have many young fans, it's about attracting new ones and keeping them or am I off my trolley? Lol. My son's just aren't interested in The Shots even though I've taken them to games. Will have to try my Grandchildren! Lol

Richard Petty
Posts: 147
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:12 pm
Location: Farnborough
Re: Accounts!!

Post by Richard Petty » Sat Feb 15, 2020 10:58 am

HackJowarth wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:48 pm
Statto wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 9:23 pm
HackJowarth wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 9:21 am
The ATFC Limited Accounts have been circulated to Shareholders etc. To say they don’t make good reading would be a huge understatement!! Of course, they need “approving” at The AGM which, is forthcoming. Said Accounts will be in the public eye via Companies House in due course. Good luck to anyone trying to explain that lot away!!
I didn't receive any accounts. All I got was the letter advising me of the AGM, an agenda for said AGM and a Form of Proxy.


In fact, I don't ever recall getting accounts up front. I always thought it odd that the first time that I (and, no doubt, many others) got to see the accounts was when they were handed out on the night, which doesn't really give you adequate time to review them and ask pertinent, informed questions.
If you are a Shareholder, you need to request them. Legally, the Limited Company must send them to you.
Spot on HackJowarth, I requested them and got them the next day, sensible not to post them out to every single shareholder as not everyone is interested in them and the postage becomes quite an expense if your sending them out as its a large letter.

Coming into the 21st century though shareholders could have a login account where documents are held for reading or downloading, my Insurance brokers do that and it works well.

WTF
Posts: 59
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2018 9:17 am
Re: Accounts!!

Post by WTF » Sat Feb 15, 2020 12:31 pm

Just spoken to my Accountant and he says that if you have not received the annual accounts that you are to receive in advance of the AGM you can ask for the AGM to be postponed and if that is refused you get Companies House involved.


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